This is my reply from Mr Thompson after I had a moan about moving A13 ST holders from the stand , particularly after the Sutton game when they hardly had any fans in the stand. His reply is obviously framed around some of my specific queries in my email.
I hope he wouldn't mind me sharing this as I think it's a well considered reply outlining some of the issues and I know other fans have also questioned the reasons.
Dear Mr
Thank you for your e-mail which has been forwarded on to me.
For some seasons now we have allowed Soft Segregation in the A13 Stand when the number of away support was forecast to be low and when the Safety Officer and Police would allow.
Before we could do this under and under the terms of our Safety Certificate we were required to seek the approval of the Local Authority and Met Police via our SAG (Safety Advisory Group).
This was agreed subject to certain conditions and this was published on our website here https://www.daggers.co.uk/tickets .
On relegation instead of picking 10 games, half at the start and the rest during the season we decided to try and minimise the number.
But this meant assessing the games on an individual basis about 4 to 6 weeks before each match.
The larger games are easy to predict, Leyton Orient for example.
Some of the other fixtures not so easy.
I must admit that at the start of the season we fully expected both Chesterfield and Barnet to bring larger support than they eventually did and they were both initially earmarked for segregation but with Chesterfield not starting well we were able to downgrade this and allow soft-segregation.
However with Barnet due to some problems with both sets of supporters at the game at the Hive it was considered that hard segregation was required, even though less than 600 were anticipated.
When we considered the Aldershot game we discussed the matter at length but decided (probably incorrectly with hindsight) to allow soft segregation and subsequently we had to close the bar early, extra police were drafted in and there were scuffles after the game at Dagenham East Underground Station.
During the debrief that we had with the Met Police a week after that game the police requested Hard Segregation for the Sutton match.
I was surprised but intelligence that the police had led them to make the request which we really had to accept.
At the start of the season apart from Barnet, Chesterfield and Leyton Orient I didn’t envisage any other league games requiring Hard Segregation, so just 3 not the 10 we have had in the past.
However there is still the possibility that the games against Eastleigh and Solihull Moors could still be chosen.
At the start of the season neither of these games would have come within this scope.
But with both teams looking for at least a Play-Off position and possibly even automatic promotion, in Solihull’s case it is feasible they could even win the title that day, the prospect of larger away support and a more volatile atmosphere is real.
A decision around Eastleigh will be made in the next few weeks.
I realise that it can be frustrating, like on Saturday, but I hope I have shown you why this is and the lengths we go too to assist supporters.
By assessing each game in turn we have been able to reduce by more than half the number of games that fall into this category which I am sure you will agree is a good thing.
With regards to announcing these games we do try and give at least 4 weeks’ notice and this is always posted on our website and then put out via our twitter and Facebook accounts https://twitter.com/Dag_RedFC/status/10 ... 8053587968
But I take on board your comment on e-mailing and will arrange for this to also be done for A13 season ticket holders.
I trust this answers your questions but if you do have any further comments please do not hesitate in contacting me.
Kind regards
Steve
Stephen Thompson MBE
Managing Director
Dagenham & Redbridge FC
The Chigwell Construction Stadium | Victoria Road | Dagenham | RM10 7XL
T: 020 8592 1549 ext 20 | E: steve@daggers.co.uk
Email from Mr Thompson re. soft segregation
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Think the reply was both fair and honest.
Safety has to be everybody's first priority ,it's sad that days we had at Harrogate yesterday are not more common.
Notice that the Police have a lot of say in such matters so i had to smile when i thought about boxing day this season. Despite the efforts made for hard segregation 80% of the home increased gate were Orient fans who found it so easy to gain access to the Home Terrace.
As it turned out it was not a problem but if a security threat is predicted by the Local Plod then the blatant access to the Home Terrace by away fans that was obvious last boxing day makes the whole operation rather pointless
Safety has to be everybody's first priority ,it's sad that days we had at Harrogate yesterday are not more common.
Notice that the Police have a lot of say in such matters so i had to smile when i thought about boxing day this season. Despite the efforts made for hard segregation 80% of the home increased gate were Orient fans who found it so easy to gain access to the Home Terrace.
As it turned out it was not a problem but if a security threat is predicted by the Local Plod then the blatant access to the Home Terrace by away fans that was obvious last boxing day makes the whole operation rather pointless
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Sutton fans (probably not real ones, day tripping stone island muppets) smashed up a pub in Bromley, made sense to close it for our game with them.
Get a bar in the home end, majority of fans wont need to sit in the A13 stand.
Get a bar in the home end, majority of fans wont need to sit in the A13 stand.
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The old excuse about bar will come out again " you can see the pitch blar blar blar " I would be able too if I climb a ladder holding a beerDiggerthedog wrote: ↑Mon Mar 04, 2019 12:48 pm Sutton fans (probably not real ones, day tripping stone island muppets) smashed up a pub in Bromley, made sense to close it for our game with them.
Get a bar in the home end, majority of fans wont need to sit in the A13 stand.
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Did I hear right that the old club shop has to be knocked around because of the new scoreboard. Why not revamp that space, take it back to the toilet block behind and make that a bar area. Build no pitch facing windows and put stewards on the door to make sure no one goes pitch side with a beer.
I always stood at football traditionally but I sat once I started going with my sons and I'm a convert from the Family Stand as my sons wanted to sit there. I like the 'organic' feel of a terrace but on balance I prefer the view personally from the A13 (I don't use the bar) and it's a big old stand to give over to 35 Gateshead fans if no home fans used it.Diggerthedog wrote: ↑Mon Mar 04, 2019 12:48 pm Sutton fans (probably not real ones, day tripping stone island muppets) smashed up a pub in Bromley, made sense to close it for our game with them.
Get a bar in the home end, majority of fans wont need to sit in the A13 stand.
Now the SE27 Dagger
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I've thought for a long time that the ground is set up all wrong. That stand always should have been a home facility - especially as it sits right on top of the dressing rooms. Where else do you go where away support gets the best view? I know the club spoke about bar sales at one point as a reason for the ground being set up as it is. Going back to the topic of segregation I'm told by my mate who was at Saturday's game, where there was no segregation, that there was a bit of argy bargy when Harrogate scored?
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And almost everyone would agree with you, however the ground has been built peicemeal over time rather than being designed as it is.hockley dagger wrote: ↑Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:03 am I've thought for a long time that the ground is set up all wrong. That stand always should have been a home facility - especially as it sits right on top of the dressing rooms. Where else do you go where away support gets the best view? I know the club spoke about bar sales at one point as a reason for the ground being set up as it is. Going back to the topic of segregation I'm told by my mate who was at Saturday's game, where there was no segregation, that there was a bit of argy bargy when Harrogate scored?
It is down to capacity of various areas, turnstyles etc. Thommo will have the debate with you if you want, and is always one to give ten good reasons something can't be done rather than one that it can.
What I'd do is switch away fans to the Bury Road terrace, which doesn't make any noise without Arnu's roof and can be horrible in dodgy weather, and give them a few seats in the corner of the Carling for those that want to sit. To do this means changing the gates though, and potentially people using the Sieve being asked to use the Bury Road turnstyles. None of this is impossible, but would mean a whole new round of moaning from those that want to drink in the clubhouse until 2:55pm on a Saturday and then get in the ground late.
As for a bar in the ground I really don't get the need for it, given so many people do drink in the clubhouse until 2:55pm. Is it that important that they get a half time beer as well?
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Having a beer at halftime is essential if we want to build as a brand, we must be one of the only clubs that does not provide this service to its own paying customers in the whole football ladder and is an essential income. I had two extra's with me for the Orient game who were shocked they could not get a beer at half time, they watch a team in the league below us where you can get a beer at any point during the game. Perhaps solve it by allowing people back in the clubhouse at half time, Solihull do this. What about beer on the back kegs you see at other venues? Plenty of options available.Mike the Dagger wrote: ↑Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:31 amAnd almost everyone would agree with you, however the ground has been built peicemeal over time rather than being designed as it is.hockley dagger wrote: ↑Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:03 am I've thought for a long time that the ground is set up all wrong. That stand always should have been a home facility - especially as it sits right on top of the dressing rooms. Where else do you go where away support gets the best view? I know the club spoke about bar sales at one point as a reason for the ground being set up as it is. Going back to the topic of segregation I'm told by my mate who was at Saturday's game, where there was no segregation, that there was a bit of argy bargy when Harrogate scored?
It is down to capacity of various areas, turnstyles etc. Thommo will have the debate with you if you want, and is always one to give ten good reasons something can't be done rather than one that it can.
What I'd do is switch away fans to the Bury Road terrace, which doesn't make any noise without Arnu's roof and can be horrible in dodgy weather, and give them a few seats in the corner of the Carling for those that want to sit. To do this means changing the gates though, and potentially people using the Sieve being asked to use the Bury Road turnstyles. None of this is impossible, but would mean a whole new round of moaning from those that want to drink in the clubhouse until 2:55pm on a Saturday and then get in the ground late.
As for a bar in the ground I really don't get the need for it, given so many people do drink in the clubhouse until 2:55pm. Is it that important that they get a half time beer as well?
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I've brought along several mates and they were all shocked they couldn't get a beer at half time too. It is just a part of football that everyone expects you can do.
Although I would have gone for it and built a proper bar & food area, it doesn't really need to be an elaborate setup. It doesn't even need lines installed. Just a space to plug in some fridges, bring a load of bottles over, then return whats left to the clubhouse bars at the 80th min.
Although I would have gone for it and built a proper bar & food area, it doesn't really need to be an elaborate setup. It doesn't even need lines installed. Just a space to plug in some fridges, bring a load of bottles over, then return whats left to the clubhouse bars at the 80th min.
I'm certainly not an expert but I'd be amazed if the profit from booze would be significant during the match with our gates. Whether having the option would bring more punters in through the gates could be an argument but I'm not convinced.Diggerthedog wrote: ↑Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:18 pmHaving a beer at halftime is essential if we want to build as a brand, we must be one of the only clubs that does not provide this service to its own paying customers in the whole football ladder and is an essential income. I had two extra's with me for the Orient game who were shocked they could not get a beer at half time, they watch a team in the league below us where you can get a beer at any point during the game. Perhaps solve it by allowing people back in the clubhouse at half time, Solihull do this. What about beer on the back kegs you see at other venues? Plenty of options available.Mike the Dagger wrote: ↑Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:31 amAnd almost everyone would agree with you, however the ground has been built peicemeal over time rather than being designed as it is.hockley dagger wrote: ↑Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:03 am I've thought for a long time that the ground is set up all wrong. That stand always should have been a home facility - especially as it sits right on top of the dressing rooms. Where else do you go where away support gets the best view? I know the club spoke about bar sales at one point as a reason for the ground being set up as it is. Going back to the topic of segregation I'm told by my mate who was at Saturday's game, where there was no segregation, that there was a bit of argy bargy when Harrogate scored?
It is down to capacity of various areas, turnstyles etc. Thommo will have the debate with you if you want, and is always one to give ten good reasons something can't be done rather than one that it can.
What I'd do is switch away fans to the Bury Road terrace, which doesn't make any noise without Arnu's roof and can be horrible in dodgy weather, and give them a few seats in the corner of the Carling for those that want to sit. To do this means changing the gates though, and potentially people using the Sieve being asked to use the Bury Road turnstyles. None of this is impossible, but would mean a whole new round of moaning from those that want to drink in the clubhouse until 2:55pm on a Saturday and then get in the ground late.
As for a bar in the ground I really don't get the need for it, given so many people do drink in the clubhouse until 2:55pm. Is it that important that they get a half time beer as well?
I'm ambivalent about it all really so not pushing one view or another but just doubtful on the economics point.
There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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I know one thing for sure - after my last visit to the A13 stand (vs Gateshead) - the bar area under the stand is a complete and utter tip and in major need of a spruce up!
There is literally nothing appealing about going under there for a beer at the moment in its current state and little wonder away fans currently choose to drink back in the clubhouse (or different venue altogether) prior to a game.
There is literally nothing appealing about going under there for a beer at the moment in its current state and little wonder away fans currently choose to drink back in the clubhouse (or different venue altogether) prior to a game.