New poll on ownership

[Diggerthedog]

I personally don't like the thought of someone taking over the club I support who has links to the likes of Mark Wright and TOWIE

..... especially the white jag man!!!

I really hope this is flippant. We need to be rising above the personalities now and start looking at the economics.

I doesn't make sense to me why anyone would favour an offer that is under half the other. The fact the Easts are leaving 49% with the Members is a total red herring. The members 49% isn't worth anything in reality unless there is a further sale of the club, and with only 1 vote on the board against 6 they have no realistic say in anything either.

On the other side, Tamplin is taking 1 vote, investing a large amount, offering future guarantees and including at least three of the current board for continuity (although not the three that people would like apparently).

It really is a choice between Tamplin and Admin as it stands surely?

So which creditor is forcing us into administration? Who do we currently owe money too? As far as I can see we have the loan for the stand the council won't force it, and the wage bill hey won't force it.

Some of you are gullible to say the least.

[Alan]

Is like to see both sides' business plans and then analyse them.

I know nothing about the business backgrounds or personalities of anyone other than what I've read. The Easts I think one is in investment banking and the other property? I don't know what the goodwins do or what Dave Ward or the former councillor bloke do or did in business.

[Mike the Dagger]

So which creditor is forcing us into administration? Who do we currently owe money too? As far as I can see we have the loan for the stand the council won't force it, and the wage bill hey won't force it.

Some of you are gullible to say the least.

Marvellous. Lets do nothing then.

Taxi for Hawkins and Whitely.

[Chigwellian]

Mike, it sounds to me by the way you are replying to comments that you have been seduced by Mr tamplin, and you are now under his spell :)

[Alan]

So which creditor is forcing us into administration? Who do we currently owe money too? As far as I can see we have the loan for the stand the council won't force it, and the wage bill hey won't force it.

Some of you are gullible to say the least.

We go back to your previous complaints about late payment of VAT, cash flow and needing loans from directors to pay the HMRC.

HMRC would put us into administration if we did not pay the VAT or PAYE. HMRC are the creditor that issues winding up petitions in most cases of football clubs going into administration.

It might be that by having a fire sale we could get rid of people off the wage bill and reduce our outgoings - but that risks reducing our income if results drop off. It's not easy. We should not be in this position, I completely agree, but we need to look at what our options are from here, not from 12 months ago.

Let's see both sides' business plans and a contingency plan for the eventuality that neither gets 75% of the members vote for it.

[Diggerthedog]

So which creditor is forcing us into administration? Who do we currently owe money too? As far as I can see we have the loan for the stand the council won't force it, and the wage bill hey won't force it.

Some of you are gullible to say the least.

We go back to your previous complaints about late payment of VAT, cash flow and needing loans from directors to pay the HMRC.

HMRC would put us into administration if we did not pay the VAT or PAYE. HMRC are the creditor that issues winding up petitions in most cases of football clubs going into administration.

It might be that by having a fire sale we could get rid of people off the wage bill and reduce our outgoings - but that risks reducing our income if results drop off. It's not easy. We should not be in this position, I completely agree, but we need to look at what our options are from here, not from 12 months ago.

Let's see both sides' business plans and a contingency plan for the eventuality that neither gets 75% of the members vote for it.

It is easy if you plan a three year forecast as most companies do or any reasonable sized company would but it seems we are just winging it.

I no longer care about this poxy takeover get on with it. Just hope Thompson is out of a job when it's done. What's the MBE stand for? Massive bell end? Complete shit show.

[Mike the Dagger]

Mike, it sounds to me by the way you are replying to comments that you have been seduced by Mr tamplin, and you are now under his spell :)

Seduced, no, but I have at least met the bloke (and the Easts). You?

All parties are saying we are in trouble for money. The timing of what that means is unclear, but we definitely have struggled with cash flow paying recent HMRC demands, which have been covered by Directors loans. The books that are available tell us that the club have been living off transfer income and FL payments, both of which are running out.

So while we might not hit the buffers in two months, or even six months, in all likelihood its coming. Yes we might be able to sell the crown jewels, maybe hang on until Ollie Hawkins commands a proper fee (not what was offered previously and turned down), but somewhere down the line we are going to be in trouble.

The two offers on the table at the moment are not comparable. Of them the Tamplin offer is vastly superior in terms of the amount of investment into the club. He's satisfied most of the objections by taking less than a 50% stake in the club and only one vote on the board, and he has the backing of John Still. He will undoubtedly shake the place up, and tbh it needs it, we've been saying it for years.

So, just on the basis of the amount of money on the table the choice is Tamplin or "Admin (somewhere down the line)".

I have a feeling that for many the real issue now is one offer leaves Steve Thompson in the club and one means he's gone. I am betting that you are one of them, and that is really what your position is based on, correct?

I no longer care about this poxy takeover get on with it. Just hope Thompson is out of a job when it's done. What's the MBE stand for? Massive bell end? Complete shit show.

And there you go!

[Chigwellian]

You are right Mike...

Steve Thompson is one of my issues, and also the person I blame for our troubles.
We have been told for yonks, that we only live within our means.
I didn't know that meant within the Thommo world of finance.

He has never wanted to hear from the supporters of ideas to improve the possibility of more revenue i.e. Club Shop.

If he would have asked for help when he should have, we probably wouldn't be in this situation.

[Diggerthedog]

Mike, it sounds to me by the way you are replying to comments that you have been seduced by Mr tamplin, and you are now under his spell :)

Seduced, no, but I have at least met the bloke (and the Easts). You?

All parties are saying we are in trouble for money. The timing of what that means is unclear, but we definitely have struggled with cash flow paying recent HMRC demands, which have been covered by Directors loans. The books that are available tell us that the club have been living off transfer income and FL payments, both of which are running out.

So while we might not hit the buffers in two months, or even six months, in all likelihood its coming. Yes we might be able to sell the crown jewels, maybe hang on until Ollie Hawkins commands a proper fee (not what was offered previously and turned down), but somewhere down the line we are going to be in trouble.

The two offers on the table at the moment are not comparable. Of them the Tamplin offer is vastly superior in terms of the amount of investment into the club. He's satisfied most of the objections by taking less than a 50% stake in the club and only one vote on the board, and he has the backing of John Still. He will undoubtedly shake the place up, and tbh it needs it, we've been saying it for years.

So, just on the basis of the amount of money on the table the choice is Tamplin or "Admin (somewhere down the line)".

I have a feeling that for many the real issue now is one offer leaves Steve Thompson in the club and one means he's gone. I am betting that you are one of them, and that is really what your position is based on, correct?

I no longer care about this poxy takeover get on with it. Just hope Thompson is out of a job when it's done. What's the MBE stand for? Massive bell end? Complete shit show.

And there you go!

I have wanted Thompson out for years nothing to do with the takeover now looming.

[steeevooo]

A couple of points:

1.) It has been mentioned earlier in the thread about Tamplins bid keeping 3 members of the current board being a positive since it offers continuity. True - this offers continuity, but it must be asked why we are even in the situation of needing investment now, and the reason for that largely lies at the door of the very same board members that he wants to keep on (unless there are further issues which we have not been made aware of). So we have found ourselves in the sh*t....lets keep on the same people that got us into it!

2.) The shake up of the club and its "commercialbility" - when will we see/feel this? According to the interview with Tamplin:

"I have agreed that the target should be back in to the Football League in the next two years and into League One two years after that. Once it is there we will have the income to stabilise the club and then look to improve the infrastructure of the place, the bars, the catering make this a place that people want to come to and watch football."

So first of all we have to get into League One within four years (reminds me of the new Aston Villa boss declaring that they will be the biggest team in the world within 5 or so years), and only then will we be able to look at improving the infrastructure. What if we don't get into League One within four years? What if we get relegated out of League One in our first season? In the best case we are still looking at 5 or more years down the line before any action is planned to transform the club commercially and its marketability. This worries me.

3.) Looking beyond the personality - that's okay, lets find the biggest, tax-dodging, drug-importing, bullying and threatening crook that we can find (note: I'm not saying that this is a representation of Tamplin) and get him to invest in us, because hey, if he's got the money to invest, and we need investment, then lets not worry about his personality. Yes - I know that is a very extreme and flippant example, but it shows that you must still consider the person and not just the money.

[Mike the Dagger]

A couple of points:

Actually you make three, but who is counting.

1.) It has been mentioned earlier in the thread about Tamplins bid keeping 3 members of the current board being a positive since it offers continuity. True - this offers continuity, but it must be asked why we are even in the situation of needing investment now, and the reason for that largely lies at the door of the very same board members that he wants to keep on (unless there are further issues which we have not been made aware of). So we have found ourselves in the sh*t....lets keep on the same people that got us into it!

I take your point, and it rather depends on what you think of the three men concerned. Keeping some kind of continuity is vital though. As best i am aware none of the other members of the various consortia (is that a word) have ever actually run a football club day to day.

2.) The shake up of the club and its "commercialbility" - when will we see/feel this? According to the interview with Tamplin:

"I have agreed that the target should be back in to the Football League in the next two years and into League One two years after that. Once it is there we will have the income to stabilise the club and then look to improve the infrastructure of the place, the bars, the catering make this a place that people want to come to and watch football."

So first of all we have to get into League One within four years (reminds me of the new Aston Villa boss declaring that they will be the biggest team in the world within 5 or so years), and only then will we be able to look at improving the infrastructure. What if we don't get into League One within four years? What if we get relegated out of League One in our first season? In the best case we are still looking at 5 or more years down the line before any action is planned to transform the club commercially and its marketability. This worries me.

Actually he said he'd get his woman in to review everything the club does straight away and fix what we can ASAP. I may have not made this clear. The point was once we get back in the FL the pressure on the finances eases and we can invest in the actual infrastructure. This was unspecified but could be all kinds of stuff like the ARNU(c) roof through to building a new clubhouse.

3.) Looking beyond the personality - that's okay, lets find the biggest, tax-dodging, drug-importing, bullying and threatening crook that we can find (note: I'm not saying that this is a representation of Tamplin) and get him to invest in us, because hey, if he's got the money to invest, and we need investment, then lets not worry about his personality. Yes - I know that is a very extreme and flippant example, but it shows that you must still consider the person and not just the money.

That was the whole point of the interview, is he someone that has honourable intentions.

As I ended it "Glenn Tamplin certainly comes across as having commitment, enthusiasm and energy, things that have been in short supply on the Daggers board for a while. The club says they have done due diligence and he's good for the money. He's now asking for less than 50% of the club and offering personal guarantees. There are no assets to strip."

You can choose to take my word for that or not. I have suggested several times that the club holds an open forum for the fans to look in the whites of Mr Tamplin's eyes and ask their own questions. Let's hope that happens.

[Phippo]

Apologies if this is off topic, but as finances crop up time and again here are a couple of observations of mine. Surely with the "clear out" of players and the influx of so many "raw" recruits the wages bill must surely be much reduced? Also the "man on the door" also lets all and sundry into the club on match days without seeing if they are entitled to free entry! This may not cost the club a great deal of money but if we are in dire straights then every little would surely help?

[diggerdagger1]

Can I ask the following questions please? Does anybody know who has pulled out of the east/goodwin consortium? The club received the revised east/Goodwin consortium bid last Monday 12th September yet still no letter to members calling an egm why? Apparently the new tamplin's consortium bid addresses the main fears of supporters in overall control issues / guarantee money issues and the reining in of Thompson is this true? The clock is ticking and the board are doing nothing.i fear at rhe egm that the members will be told the choice us clear either tamplin's or administration. Will probably be told the other consortium bid does not even touch the debt situation! Totally unfair imo.

[Alan]

Might still be waiting for legal advice on the procedure for transferring the assets and capital gains tax implications. They do need to crack on with it, get the bidders to submit their final bids and plans then hold the EGM. The delay is really unhelpful.

[diggerdagger1]

Totally fed up with the unfairness of it all. The east/Goodwin consortium submitted there final revised bid on Monday 12th September. Tamplin's consortium revised bid was submitted in Dave Bennetts letter to members on the 6th September and that was £800,000 for 80 percent. Percentage wise both bids very similar. Now we have apparently another revised bid by tamplin's consortium of 1.3 million. Tamplin's now appears to be giving way on the 3 issues in my previous post on this matter so why don't both consortiums get back round the table again? I I both final bids should have been secret and dealt with by an independent body. Level playing fields and office of fair trading spring to mind.